Gyutae: You’ve come on strong over the past 6 months and developed yourself as a prominent SEO blogger in the industry. Can you share some more background information on yourself? How did you come across SEO and why does it interest you so much?

Gab: The honest truth is that prominence in SEO is highly transient. A year ago hardly anyone in search knew me, and vice versa. I still don’t consider myself a prominent SEO blogger, but I’ve made some friends at Sphinn and on StumbleUpon and that’s helped enormously. I’d say that some people like yourself – who were one of the first to comment on my blog – have come to know me and become friends with me as a result; this in turn gets me some attention. So the truth is that I have some prominent friends but could do more to build an audience myself. SU’s ridiculous move in banning SEO ads from search has put a dent in my promotional tactics though. Just wanted to clarify that point before addressing your questions .

As to myself, I’m a 20 year old McGill law student (21 June 4th ) in Montreal, Canada. Some of my personal passions are soccer, business, my mother’s cooking, and reading. Sometimes I read when my time would be better spent working for clients or myself, but life needs to be enjoyed too, you know?

I came across SEO either at Problogger or Entrepreneur’s Journey – I can’t remember which. One probably pointed me to another. I was searching for keywords like “blog promotion” and “website promotion” (which suggests why spammy services often focus on those general keywords; they’re going after newbs) because I had a blog I wanted to make more influential.

The reason why SEO interests me so much is probably a mixture of the ability to influence others through it as well as the commercial potential inherent in search marketing. I love the fact that it’s mass permission marketing (though with all due respect to Seth Godin, I wouldn’t classify traditional firms using SEO as making Meatball Sundaes, which he implies in his book) . Another thing that I love is that the people in search are so friendly. Tamar Weinberg is so sweet and approachable it’s shocking, particularly for a social media superstar like her. Likewise Rebecca Kelley at SEOmoz. XMCP at Slightly Shady SEO is so helpful and patient with others who aren’t at his level of expertise that it’s quite surprising, especially for a blackhat. I could go on, but in short, have a look here for more of what I mean.

Gyutae: What are your favorite types of clients? Least favorite?

Gab: In an attempt to better qualify potential clients/leads, I made a page describing who my ideal clients are.
Unfortunately, I haven’t made it prominent enough and so I still get occasional leads from people whose budgets are too tight or who don’t appreciate that the value I’m creating for them is multiple times what they’re paying me. For example, an affiliate site of mine took 2 hours to create, and perhaps 3-4 to promote. That earned the merchant over $2,400 to date. And it should continue earning them nice sales. When you can create that kind of value for people and they don’t understand that they have to pay you accordingly, well, those are the worst clients.

For example, some guy named Alex called me up about a month back. He had read about SEO and got the impression that it was the “key to marketing online”. He went on to try and get me to work for free and get him ranking for “travel insurance” and such, thinking I’d be overjoyed to do some work since I’m so young and “need it” to build my portfolio. He didn’t know what SMX was, thought that paid links “wouldn’t be necessary” in that niche and wasted an hour of my time droning along on the phone. He was the human equivalent to one of those 10-screen/scroll-long clickbank get-rich-quick-ebook sales letters. Please don’t get in touch if that’s your mentality.

Gyutae: What has been your most effective method of attracting new clients for SEO services?

Gab: Word of mouth has attracted some nice leads, and my first serious client, this downtown Montreal boutique hotel and their youth hostel, the Auberge de Paris. I was chatting with the owner’s nephew, a friend, at a party one night about SEO. He referred his uncle to me later on.

SEO has been a mixed bag. On the one hand it got me working with The Business Card Creator and they really understand and appreciates search marketing’s value. It’s a pleasure and a joy working with them. On the other, my rankings for Montreal SEO, SEO (on Google.ca) and other terms have generated nothing, or else price-sensitive leads that wasted my time. It’s kind of ironic when you think about it. Rand answered my question the same way here.

Gyutae: You’re a 21 year old still in school and running a business at the same time. How do you manage all of this and what has been your biggest struggle?

Gab: Great question! In all honesty I did a horribly shabby job of it. SEO is just so much more fun than law school! I was waaay behind on my reading and outright stopped reading for one course when we changed the readings to history from cases (I like history, but I hadn’t noticed that there was a separate book we needed for those readings and decided not to buy it). That stressed me out incredibly. I crammed hard for my December exams though, and pulled off a B average (which is fine by me, since I’m not trying to work in law). I’m still waiting on grades for the winter/spring term.

At the same time though, I was working really hard on SEO and my search marketing business. Preparing my first SMX presentation, developing my social media relationships, and building my RSS subscriber base (now over 1,500) was all very time consuming, besides keeping up with client work.

On a related note, the “What Would Seth Godin Do” plugin is a NECESSITY for building your RSS subscriber base. In one fell stroke, you mine the value of all your posts for gaining readers. If you want to get more advanced, I recommend click tracking on a post-level. That way you can tell what posts are most successful at attracting new readers. I use the free PHP Click Counter from PHP Junkyard, though I’ll be looking for a more robust script as my volume scales (that one has issues with its text database corrupting at ~10,000 clicks) .

Besides the trouble keeping up with school, my biggest challenge has been attracting new clients. For whatever reason, my lead-to-sale conversion rate is awful. I think I’m a poor salesman really, and I’ve been considering finding a salesman who’ll work on commission. It’s really frustrating. Anyone reading this who can help please get in touch! (Gab at my domain).

Gyutae: What do you study? Has it helped you at all as an SEO consultant? What do you plan on doing after graduation? Long term goals?

Gab: I’m studying law at McGill. It’s pretty funny to me in hindsight, because I worked extremely hard for years to get in, and now that I’m there I wish I had graduated already. Also, the bloody McGill management and computer science faculties make it nearly impossible to register for their courses if you’re not in their faculty… But I digress.

It’s helped me understand contracts, non-disclosure agreements, and Sarah Bird and Eric Goldman’s blogging. Michael Geist is also making more sense now. It’s also made me realize how generally nonsensical the adage “Ignorance of the law is no excuse” is. That saying’s based on the law being publicly available to read, yet unless you’ve studied law, it’s ridiculously difficult to understand, quite often. Heck, I’m registered for a course next year on “Statutory Interpretation.” What if you never had the chance to take that course?

After graduation, I figure I’ll still be running SEO ROI, though I hope to have grown it somewhat between now and then. I definitely see myself working in search marketing in the medium term. It’s so much fun! In the long term, I have plans for software and other online-oriented businesses.

At that point SEO ROI will probably become an in-house search team, or else I’ll hire AIM Clear, NetConcepts or Matt McGee if he’s running his own search company at that point in time. I’d probably also have the initial site designs done by Rustybrick, SEO Design Solutions or David Mihm. I note in passing that all of those folks caught my attention through Sphinn and/or their blogs, which is saying something about the long term/bigger picture value of social media.

Gyutae: You recently had the opportunity of speaking on a panel at SMX West. How was that experience and how has it helped your business? Were you nervous?

Gab: SMX West to me was like being an elephant in a peanut shop – a nonstop thrill. I met so many friends that I only know from the online world and made so many new ones too! I can’t name em all here, though I tried to name and link to as many of those that made a positive impression as possible here. Apologies to those that I forgot! One of the highlights for me was meeting the SEOmoz team and other mozzers – my favorite search community.

They were also really awesome, helpful and supportive at the airport when I realized I had forgotten my laptop at the conference center. Both them and Third Door Media were unbelievably awesome, and Third Door even sent me my laptop by courier for free – diagonally across North America! I’m telling you – the search community is awesome.

What I’m saying is that as far as helping my business, that was huge for networking. And from a strictly “ROI” perspective, I can’t tell you how many links that got me as a result.

Speaking itself was a little challenging. I think that my content was fresh and original, but I made a couple of jokes that fell flat. People came up to me afterwards saying that they enjoyed it though, so it couldn’t have been too shabby. For other speakers, I recommend you buy “Speak Like Churchill, Stand Like Lincoln” by James C. Humes (eBay has it cheaper than Amazon). Since reading that, two speeches I’ve given went off exceedingly well to captive audiences. Hopefully I can repeat that at SMX Advanced, where I’m speaking on the Site Buying Panel .

As to being nervous, I’ve done lots of public speaking before and lead/coached the senior debating team in high school, so that’s not a problem.

Gyutae: Do you run any of your own sites for profit? If so, how are they doing? Why do you do consulting when you can just work for yourself doing SEO?

Gab: I mentioned earlier the affiliate site that did those sales for the merchant. I’m getting more and more into it and am currently link building for a second affiliate site, hoping to see results by late July. Much thanks go to XMCP at Slightly Shady SEO and Smaxor’s Oooff Internet/Affiliate Marketing Blog for getting me back into affiliate marketing after AzoogleAds turned me off it by paying me months late with a stupid excuse.

You can just work for yourself doing SEO, it’s true, but not being a thin affiliate is very difficult. And the top cats like Todd Malicoat, Michael Gray and Rae Hoffman are building communities and creating other barriers to entry, so the competition heats up daily. Which goes back to your point about getting started ASAP. In hindsight I wish I’d listened when Yaro Starak first counseled me to buy my own domain and do things the right way.

Another point is that no matter how great you get at marketing, you need to have capital to back you. That’s what client work is good for – a steady stream of money to reinvest. My best friend’s mom asked me what I’ve saved after two years doing this, a few months ago, and I told her that I only had a couple thousand in the bank (some of which was from previous lifeguarding work). That’s because I’ve reinvested. I bought a professional design, got custom plugins, advertised, and bought a boatload of domains (including a couple of French language generics) etc.

Finally, no matter how great you are at marketing, you don’t have a business. I could be the best SEO in the world, but if I had no hotel to promote, who would pay me (bad example given affiliate opportunities in travel, but you get my point..)? Besides which, affiliate marketing isn’t necessarily stable income. We independent webmasters, in discussing that question, tend to forget that most of the transactions in the economy are done offline…

Gyutae: Who are you top 5 SEO inspirations? Top 5 sites that you follow?

Gab: It’s ridiculously tough picking just 5 – I read 15-20 hours a week to keep my skills up to date. So there’s many more than those I’ll name here, because Sphinn is awesome in helping me find quality reading.

SEOmoz is like a home away from home. If there’s one blog I have to read, it’s the moz. For whatever reason, I rather return in my browser than read it in my reader. I think it’s more fun seeing it in full color or something, which brings me back. They completely deserve the best SEO blog award they’ve won a few years in a row now.

XMCP, like I said, is a big inspiration. One of my first original ideas, cloning expired sites, came from a discussion with him about expired domains still in the Yahoo directory.

He’s also one of the foremost experts on Facebook PPC to my mind, with Marty of AimClear. If you’re looking to advertise there, I’d hire one of those two depending on whether you like consultants or agencies better.

SEL is also huge, and frequently feature quality stuff. On the flip side, they also let search vets off with veeeery average and sometimes even mediocre posts. I won’t name names (can you spell career-suicide?) but it’s really, really lame when that happens. And even more pathetic when those posts go hot on Sphinn. I just saw two from SEL, as a matter of fact. Had they come from anywhere else, no one would have paid attention/sphunn the pieces.

The other two I’m a big fan of are Sphinn discoveries.

Search Engine People feature consistently high quality and original writing. Consider Ruud Hein’s series, How Search Really Works. He’s now doing something similar with The Algo is Human. Jeff, Dev, Tom and Jenn are also awesome bloggers and SEP is quickly becoming one of my first daily reading stops.

Finally, Chris Winfield, Danielle and the gang at 10e20 regularly publish premium content. Their post on linkbait graphics were a fresh look, and on and on like that. I’d like to take this moment to highlight that Chris has pulled off ANOTHER huge media mention.

Top 5 sites I follow (i.e. beyond search) are:

Avinash Kaushik’s blog, Occam’s Razor is great on analytics. Come to think of it, I have some catching up to do there.

Mind Valley Labs are shockingly under-appreciated in the search community. They feature some of the best damn posts in the whole online marketing industry and it’s a crying shame that no one’s paying attention. Look at this post on Frank Kern’s copywriting, this item on generating big ideas and just about anything they write. I LOVE their blog. It’s also a huge opportunity to network with some of the best folks in marketing as they hardly get any comments on the blog.

Maki’s blog, naturally, is premium on all things internet marketing. I gave him top a CASE award.

Grok Dot Com and most things by Future Now are quality publications; I think they have something to do with Marketing Experiments as well, which I recommend.

Finally, Closed Loop Marketing publishes original material that’s more focused on ROI than just about anything else online. Which makes sense, considering its head honchos, Lance Loveday and Sandra Niehaus, wrote Web Design 4 ROI, which is THE book to buy on building sites properly. I can’t say enough good things about the book, which I’ve had my sister read and have now lent to my girlfriend’s mom, who owns a small jewelry site specializing in South American handcrafted silver jewelry.

Gyutae: Where do you think SEO will be in 5 years? How are you preparing for the coming shifts?

Gab: That depends largely on where the search engines will be in 5 years, and where information retrieval will be. Some possibilities:

Ranking according to friends’ recommendations. Friends often have similar taste (in clothes, if not necessarily in food) and are more trusted than the government, universities, the Fortune 500 or other standard ‘trusted authority sites’. This idea makes a lot of sense to me personally, since this is often how people find out about new things, like musicians, restaurants, vacation spots etc. This also means that the role of Influentials (read the book) is going to increase. You can check out my post on influence for more.

If MSN and Yahoo can stop being a bunch of clowns, maybe Google would have some competition in Western countries and we could all be that much less dependent. I was at Compete.com today and they showed Yahoo.com and Google.com as having equivalent amounts of traffic. Why in hell is Yahoo funneling so much of it towards their content? Google has proven that being the middleman rather than the destination is 100 times more profitable. Get people searching, Yahoo!

We’re going to see increasing regulation, particularly in terms of antitrust, intellectual property and freedom of speech. We have to.

Google has far too much power and becomes a little more like Big Brother every day. Take a seat for a second and consider how much data Google has on the typical webmaster. Now consider who creates the web. Scary, isn’t it, that Google should have so much information on such a uniquely powerful group? Here’s a fun exercise: Sit down and try and come up with 5 Google services you use. I’ll bet you that it takes no time at all.

As far as IP goes, the number of TM suits increases daily, to say nothing of the rampant scraping/republishing that goes on. Government should pursue policies similar to how online gambling was banned from the US – cut the banks out of the picture. Sure, the Russians will still do it, but right there you just eliminated AdSense as a revenue model and plenty of affiliate networks etc. This should get internationalized in treaties, afterwards, hopefully.

As to freedom of speech, hate speech shouldn’t be given the distribution it does in the name of the politically correct euphemism of alternate viewpoints. Watch Jew Tube, read this Jew FAQ and “Who Is a Jew”. For those of you scratching your heads, read this. Freedom of speech needs to have other limits too. Reputation management problems caused by unsavory competition (e.g. fake reviews), ex-es (e.g. ‘my ex-husband is a pedophile axe murderer’) and places like RipOff Report can’t be allowed to continue.

Gyutae: What are some tips you can give for aspiring SEO consultants?

Gab: Network your ass off.

Comment with your real name in the comments, and say something useful besides “I agree, great post, you taught me a lot here.” Maki wrote a great piece on proper commenting, which ironically led to a flood of these “thanks for the awesomeness” craptastic comments (it was awesome, but if you’re just commenting to say that, you’re annoying and discouraging those people who want to add value to the conversation because their comment will get pushed further down. (The flip side is that for popular bloggers who get these comments a lot, they should delete a lot of these comments if you want to foster a truly great community.)

Link out like there’s no tomorrow. And make an effort to constantly be developing new relationships. It’s cool to have some “online best friends” but it’s lame if you then only hang out with them. Lame for your career and future success, I mean.

Submit other people’s content to social media sites, then email to encourage them to vote (and thus indirectly highlight who submitted ). The email’s optional for people who pay attention to social media and their logs, but when you find a great source that doesn’t pay much attention to social media, such emails are more necessary. They’re usually welcome and often requested, anyways.

Gyutae: Thanks!

Gab: My pleasure

For more interviews of top Internet marketers, be sure to check out Winning the Web’s Winners’ Circle.

Gab also does research on online behavior. One particular one he’s discovered is that 30% of Facebook users have pics of themselves nude!“

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI

• Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman
• Interview with Tyler Cruz, an Internet Entrepreneur
• 6 Questions I Asked Aaron Wall Over Dinner – Learn the SEO Secrets He Doesn’t Share on His Blog
• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Interview with Prija from Blogging the Movie

What’s your reasoning for doing this? You’d be the last person I would expect to be guest posting and interviewing.

As a marketing experiment AND because I was getting board writing my site…but more the first than the second.

SEO is a long and hard process. How did you fund yourself and keep your head up in the beginning when times were unknown and money was scarce?

I got a credit card which probably was dumb, but then I got another job to hold me over on the financial front. I was also lucky in that I did not have any kids or anybody to support when I was first starting out, so I could afford to take some risks.

I think one of the things that helped me out was that rather than trying to make as much money as quick as possible I tried learning like a machine. I read books like this one and I also read a lot of great books about the psychology of the web (The Cluetrain Manifesto, Don’t Make Me Think) and lots of great marketing books (Purple Cow, The Tipping Point). If you are new to the web and can not afford lots of the higher price point material many of these books are worth more than some things being sold at much higher price points.

I went to one of Seth Godin’s in office meetings back in 2004. On his table he had a list of remarkable products that were well marketed. In my camera I had pictures of some of those same products from when I saw them out and about. Realizing how successful Seth is, and seeing that I was instinctively aware of some of the stuff he thought was great was a great confidence booster.

What were some of the ways you built yourself up as an authority on SEO?

Off the start the big thing was participating in forums. Back then I would say forums were about where blogs are now…blogs are more dominant currently though. A key to getting noticed was not to be one of 100,000 forum members, but instead to contribute where it was easier to stick out on smaller sites. So I moderated a couple SEO forums.

When the Google Florida update happened I did a ton of research about what happened and wrote an article about it. Reflecting upon that article it was not perfect, but it was good enough to get me a lot of exposure and more leads than I could handle. While I had lots of market attention I went on a link bulding binge, turning that 15 seconds of fame into a lot of high authority links. For example, I did things like look for co-citation between two competing sites where I knew one of the sites moved, and then I would email the webmasters to let them know that other site moved and that it would be cool if they could list me too.

At the end of 2003 I started blogging. Which was huge for building mindshare and subscribers.

From there the other big things I have done to be remarkable and get well known were

• I got sued by Traffic Power (which ended up working out to a stressful but profitable $40,000 link buy and public relations campaign)
• I created a bunch of cool free SEO Tools and give them away.
• I spoke at a bunch of conferences (great for building authority and attracting great clients, if you desire clients)

What are some of the most effective creative link building tactics that you have used to build up your search rankings?

• Giving away software, tools, and widgets work great.
• Getting sued worked remarkably well.
• Social interactions and contests (like your recent WinningTheWeb contest) help build a lot of exposure fast
• The other thing that is really important for standing out is creating featured content. Articles like our Blogger’s Guide to SEO and our 101 link building tips got a lot of exposure and links.

What are the factors you take into consideration when breaking into a niche with a new site?

What can I do that is different and gives me a competitive advantage here? How can I create something that is powerful that is hard for the competition to clone? Some of the best assets turn out to be domain name, social relationships, community features, aggressively promoted leading editorial content, and site design.

You also have to think of a concept you want to stand for. Something to believe in that is not already dominated. For instance, Danny Sullivan = search = Danny Sullivan. No matter how hard I might try search will never be equal to me. I had to be more niche than that…I started owning concepts like seo book and seo blog and have tried to spread that to SEO, and over time I suspect we will move into other related fields as well, but you have to pick who you want to compete against.

What are your plans for the future? Will you be focusing your efforts on SEO Book or tapping into new markets and Internet marketing strategies? (ppc, affiliate, etc)

I still intend to market the site somewhat aggressively, but honestly I am quite fine if our SEO training program has an organic growth profile. The harder you push growing a private community the more you distort stuff…better to let it build over time, get feedback, refine it, improve it, etc. Plus I am capping it at 1,000 members to ensure I have time to spend with all the community members. We are already about 2/3 of the way there.

I have a lot of other site development projects I work on as well. My wife has been heading up many of these. If we work on some of these only 5% or 10% as much as we work on SeoBook.com then we should honestly stand a good chance of dominating those markets.

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



6 Questions I Asked Aaron Wall Over Dinner – Learn the SEO Secrets He Doesn’t Share on His Blog

• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Which Came First, the Traffic or the Search Engine Rankings?
• The Secret to Making Every Link Count For Your SEO Rankings
• Crawl Rate is the New Google Page Rank – Use These Great Tools
• How to Build the Best Natural Links – Revealed by 6 SEO Experts

Gyutae: First of all, I’d like to congratulate you on your marriage to the studliest man in SEO. Care to share how you and Aaron met and fell in love?

Giovanna: Thanks. Yes, I bought his book after being ripped off by a sleazy SEO company that SEMPO recommended. I scheduled for his free 15 minute consultation, which was a service he provided back then. To be honest, he wasn’t very nice to me at first and he did chew out my site design. Then for some reason, the subject changed and we were talking about music. The 15 minute consultation lasted for over 45 minute. We started chatting almost on a daily basis for 2 months. He flew to California to visit me and I thought he was a cool guy but had no idea that our friendship would lead to marriage. We’re pretty happy because we’re both geeks and are always on the same “bandwidth”.

Gyutae: I understand that you were involved in SEO and Internet marketing (or at least bought SEO Book) before your relationship with Aaron. What was your background and how did you get introduced to the industry?

Giovanna: After college, I started my career in marketing high technology (microprocessors) in the Silicon Valley. Then I took a career change and worked in interior design. It was fun because I liked designing kitchens and bathrooms. A friend suggested that I market products on the web because that was her business model. That’s how it all started.

Gyutae: You recently wrote your first post for SEO Book. How did that feel? Did you expect to receive the response that you did? What are some of the future plans for your involvement with SEO Book?

Giovanna: The first post was interesting and something that bothered me for a while (Wikipedia). Aaron suggested that I go ahead and write about it and got some positive response from his audience. I’m going to support my husband all the way. For future plans, I will help out by managing some of his work. I want to be the pillar that supports him.

Gyutae: Is Aaron sharing his SEO secrets with you? What are some of the most important lessons that you’ve learned from him in terms of Internet business?

Giovanna: He doesn’t share secrets with me unless I pay him $500 for an hour of consultation. Just kidding. There really are no secrets with SEO. It’s all a matter of hard work and creativity. Aaron isn’t black hat at all. Nowhere near. I learned a lot from him and vice versa. His best lesson is how to gain market share by simply creating value.

Gyutae: What are some of your future goals online? Are you working exclusively with Aaron or do you have some of your own web projects? Anything you want to specialize in particularly?

Giovanna: I have both. Projects with Aaron and independent ones I run. The only reason Aaron isn’t involved is because the topics are very feminine

Gyutae: What’s 1 thing that nobody knows about Aaron Wall?

Giovanna: He drools so much that our dog licks his pillow when it gets thirsty.

So there you have it folks… Giovanna Wall, the latest addition to the Winners’ Circle. Look forward to more Winners’ Circle interviews in the coming weeks.

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna

• 14 Steps to Transforming Your Career Path to Super SEO Status
• 6 Questions I Asked Aaron Wall Over Dinner – Learn the SEO Secrets He Doesn’t Share on His Blog
• Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman
• How an SEO can Prepare for Microhoo, the Microsoft-Yahoo Combo
• Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI

So without further adieu, here it is. Interviews with Gyutae Park around the web, sorted by date. I’ll be updating the list as more are included.

• Shooting Money Out Of Your Other End To Gain…? – Jan. 4, 2008
  An interesting interview with Mike Huang of Bloggin-Ads.com covering my John Chow review contest, advertising costs, sources of revenue, and aspects of my personal life.

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interviews with Gyutae Park of Winning the Web

• Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman
• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Interview with Prija from Blogging the Movie
• Interview with Tyler Cruz, an Internet Entrepreneur
• Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI

Name: Prija Phaphouampheng
Age: 25

Average monthly income: Through Blogging the Movie I currently only make a little over 2 hundred. However, my current Free Car giveaway promotion is running at 1.5k a month, but it’s all reinvested for marketing purposes for the documentary.

Favorite method of making money online: Selling direct car sponsorship ads. I take 100%, there is no middle man besides Paypal. Buying a $100 car sponsorship ads gets 2 reviews, a permanent link on my car page and as an added bonus you get your domain name on the 1st ever FREE CAR giveaway. Only 500 bloggers / companies can be part of this Blogging the Movie brand.

Top money maker: Again my car sponsorship, I made 2k in 2 days after getting a John Chow review.

Gyutae: It’s ironic that you have a contest going for Blogger Rookie of the Year because you are an up and coming blogger yourself. The project that really got your name out there is Blogging the Movie. How did you come up with this idea?

Prija: It is ironic. I came up with this idea after reading the Four Hour Workweek. I realized that I need to think of an idea that can be scalable. If I can convey a message in a documentary to millions of bloggers and stamp my movie to by synonymous with blogging, it can easily become a classic documentary. My goal is to become a stepping stone for all those curious about blogging.

Gyutae: Your plan is to raise enough money through sponsorships so that you can give away a car and receive funding for your blogging documentary film. How is your plan going so far? Are you on track to start filming next year?

Prija: Raising the funds is great, and so far I’ve raised $2,800. However, I’m not too worried about not selling all the ads. If there are only 100 people who buy the spots then they will still be awarded the 2 reviews and the permanent link and be refunded their full amount of $100. I’m already in works with some private investors to potentially fund the movie, so things are RIGHT on track.

Gyutae: A blogging documentary is something that definitely has not been done before. How do you think bloggers are perceived today and how will your movie change that perception?

Prija: For the most part, blogging in the US is popularized from celebrity blog sites TMZ, Perez Hilton, or personal blog diaries. There is this huge gap of what can really be done with blogging. My movie will showcase how we are changing the way we consume information. The power of the individuals will dictate what is relevant. If you can imagine that there are 120,000 blogs created everyday. That means their content is being pushed on to the web like a growing unstoppable rolling snowball or mass of information. This snowball increases each day at a phenomenal rate and it’s up to bloggers to dictate what is relevant and important. Everyone has a voice, so it’s time to be heard.

Gyutae: You attended Blog World Expo this year and set up a booth for Blogging the Movie. What was the general level of support? Are bloggers open to the idea of revealing their private and professional lives for all to see? What about the possibility of your movie bringing in more blogging copycats into an already crowded industry?

Prija: Everyone loved the project, and everyone wanted to be part of the movie. The bloggers love the idea because they will have a chance to showcase to the unknown public who they are outside of blogging. Blogging copycats will eventually phase out after 3-6 months of blogging, it comes with the hype, the true bloggers will bring quality content.

Gyutae: Who are you most excited about working with and following in your movie?

Prija: Mostly I’m excited working with John Chow. His famous PDF file influenced me to start blogging in June.

Gyutae: Do you have any other projects in the works besides this one?

Prija: Right now, I actually have a non-profit organization called the OCEducationCenter.org. We just received our 501(c)(3) status with the IRS and we are on our way for 2008 to raise funds for scholarships. These scholarships are given away to graduating high school seniors from low income families attending 4-year colleges for the first year. This is a side project of mine which has been in the works for about a year now. Other than that, like most bloggers I have a full-time job working in business and marketing.

Gyutae: What do you think is the most effective method for bloggers to network online and build a personal brand?

Prija: Try to network in different niches. Coming from a stand point that I came into this blogosphere knowing nothing. I mean absolutely nothing. I have no SEO / Internet marketing skills. I was just a clever guy that thought outside the box. The greatest thing you can do is to offer free reviews. I gained my rise to fame from my 1st site Cash For Comments, where I gave out free reviews for 5 comments. The first month into blogging I gained over 300 genuine comments. Granted I was busy giving away 30 reviews; it really jump started me to become a household name as the Sneaky Bastard in the blogosphere. The Sneaky Bastard, was coined through my innovative guerrilla marketing tactics. With my free review promotion I was able to make loyal readers. You need to give more than you can receive as a newbie to gain recognition that you are benefiting the community.

Gyutae: Greatest tip for an aspiring blogger just getting started?

Prija: Think big, be different. If you follow the black ant you’ll become a black ant. Find your own identity.

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interview with Prija from Blogging the Movie

• Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman
• Interview with Tyler Cruz, an Internet Entrepreneur
• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI
• Interviews with Gyutae Park of Winning the Web

In case you’re not familiar with this site, Winners’ Circle is a series of interviews with a wide variety of personalities on the web including successful Internet entrepreneurs, top SEOs and marketers, online publishers, web designers, bloggers, and affiliate marketers. If you feel that you’re an online winner worthy of being featured in the Winners’ Circle, be sure to contact me.

Alright, without further adieu, the second edition of Winners’ Circle features… Ms. Danielle!

Ms. Danielle is a lovely lady from Orange County, CA who works as a PPC account manager as well as for her own entrepreneurial Internet projects. Her most recent website is Pink Deals, a shopping site for women’s products. Danielle also keeps an “ego blog” with her personal thoughts on the industry that showcase her wonderful personality. Good stuff, Danielle. Now on to the questions…

Gyutae: You started a brand new Internet marketing blog in March 2007 and have turned it into something substantial. Did you ever think you’d be where you are today?

Danielle: Not particularly. I started the blog as an experiment to see where I could take it. So far I think it’s done pretty well but I’m looking to grow it a bit more in the near future. I don’t know how substantial it is now, I suppose my readers can tell me that

Gyutae: What are your future goals for the blog? Where do you ultimately want to be?

Danielle: Future goals for my blog have never really changed. I’ve always tried to focus on creating quality content relating to Internet marketing and pay per click marketing, plus interjecting pieces of my personal stories into it. Where I want to be? I want to be at a point where affiliate money is keeping me free from “the daily grind.” That would be my ultimate goal.

Gyutae: How has your work as a PPC Account Manager for an SEM agency changed your views of the Internet? What have you learned?

Danielle: Working for an Internet marketing firm has completely changed my view of the Internet. I really had no idea how any of this “make money online” stuff worked entering the field. All I knew was that I was going to be in charge of driving traffic to our sites through pay per click. Once I realized the potential of online revenue I was really floored. I wanted to make money on anything! But I soon realized that you have to pick the right product, know your market, and know your conversion time tables. A lot of industries convert at different intervals. I’ve started a variety of sites and tried different things. Internet marketing is all about trial and error, and not giving up.

Gyutae: Any plans of going out on your own and starting a business for yourself?

Danielle: I have my own business right now, mainly for tax purposes rather than for branding. I do some consulting and am looking to really kick things up a notch in 2008. I hope it’s a good year for me. I also work very closely with my friend Gary Lee and we’ll probably be taking on more projects together after the start of next year as well.

Gyutae: If you could only own 1 website, which niche would you choose?

Danielle: The site that I already own, pinkdeals.net. Right now I’m finding difficulties in keeping the content fresh, but only because my time is currently limited. But the guys at Unique Blog Designs are almost completed with my new theme, and I’m very excited to update the site. After the end of the year I’ll also have more free time to work on it. The niche is women 18 – 45 who have expendable income, want to buy stuff for themselves, and who like to save money shopping. I think it’s a great niche and it’s one I want to soon dominate. We’ll see if that happens, though

Gyutae: This whole Internet industry is pretty male dominant. What is it like being a young Asian female in this atmosphere?

Danielle: I can’t complain. In the realm of marketing, anything that gives you an advantage helps. Being a girl is a benefit, the way I see it, not a detriment.

Gyutae: Who is your greatest online money making inspiration?

Danielle: At the moment, Zac Johnson. Not only does he freely give information on how to help other affiliates make money, he’s all around a really cool person. In terms of all time, it’s my boss. He’s taught me more than I could ever learn about internet marketing, affiliate marketing, and PPC. He was highly successful in one of the toughest markets last year, and I commend him for the business decisions he’s made along the way.

Gyutae: What do you think is the most effective method for bloggers to network online and build a personal brand?

Danielle: What worked for me was going out and making myself known. Commenting on blogs, leaving thoughtful or insightful comments, showing I have a brain and I know how to use it. Throwing around ideas with my friends, keeping the creative juices flowing, being OK with criticism. And surrounding myself with like-minded people. Just as in real life, you have to surround yourself with the right network. Being able to discern who is on the same page as you is vital, I think. And go to conferences! The most important thing I learned after BlogWorld was solidifying existing relationships in real life. There’s nothing more valuable in networking than meeting your peers face to face. I feel it establishes a lot more trust.

Gyutae: Greatest tip for an aspiring blogger just getting started?

Danielle: Like I always say, “When you don’t feel like writing, just write.” Becoming stagnant and giving in to the feeling of blog burnout will kill most blogs. The lowest points of traffic were when I gave into that feeling. I feel rejuvenated now and will do everything it takes to keep up on my writing. I sort of think of a blog as starting a new company. Knowing that it’s going to be a part of your everyday life for who knows how long, is important.

Thanks, Danielle!

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman

• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Interviews with Gyutae Park of Winning the Web
• Interview with Prija from Blogging the Movie
• Interview with Tyler Cruz, an Internet Entrepreneur
• Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI

First up we have Tyler Cruz, a very successful Internet entrepreneur who one day decided to move out of his parents’ house and venture out on his own in Internet business. A very fun ride indeed. I’m sure he’s not looking back. Take a look below and see if you can achieve similar success.

Name: Tyler Cruz
Age: 24
Average monthly income: Around $6,000/month, not counting domain/site sales such as the $23,000 domain brokerage earlier this year.
Favorite method of making money online: Anything that is passive, residual, income, such as lifetime referral/affiliate earnings. Selling private ads on websites would be second.
Top money maker: PokerForums.org

Now into the head of Tyler Cruz…

Gyutae: A couple years back, you moved out of your parents’ place and decided to live out on your own. Looking back, do you think this was a risky decision?

Tyler: It depends how you define ‘risky’. I was only 21 or 22 at the time and it’s not like I was working a prestigious job as a hedge fund manager or anything. The only risk involved was that if I couldn’t make enough to support myself then I’d have to get a temporary ‘real’ job until I could find a way to do so. I was fully prepared to work at McDonald’s if I had to as I knew it would only be temporary.

The ‘McDonald’s’ factor was certainly a help in pushing me to be successful online, but the truth is that I was already making around $2,000 per month online at the time I moved out. The real question was if I could sustain this, as it was just enough money to live comfortably on.

I often hear young webmasters and entrepreneurs saying that they’d need at least $5,000 a month to live comfortably and do this for a living. This obviously depends on where you live because of housing costs, but for the most part I think this is a major exaggeration. I was very comfortable living on my own when I was making $2,000 a month. Things change a lot when you’re only working a few hours per day, from home. Life is a lot easier and less stressful than working a traditional 9-5 job, and $2,000 a month can buy you all the comforts you need if you really think about it.

At $4,000 a month as a web entrepreneur, I think you can live like a king. Remember, the fact that you’re working from home, as your own boss, and working when you want to adds a lot of value to that $2,000 or $4,000 a month.

Gyutae: What is your favorite part about working for yourself from home?

Tyler: I’d say there are four favorite things, if I may.

1. Freedom

I’ve been very busy with work the past few weeks, backlogged and swamped, really. But I still only work around 3-4 hours a day. I refuse to work any more than I feel comfortable with, as then work stops being fun. And that’s the whole point.

If I wanted, I could take a 1-month trip right now. Or, I could travel the world as a wandering nomad for the rest of my life, as long as I bring my laptop with me.

As we speak, I’m listening to music and am massaging in my new leather massage chair, drinking a Red Bull. In 30-minutes I plan to go play some Legend of Zelda on the Nintendo Wii I just bought. This is my life.

2. Being my own boss

I don’t have a boss to report or suck up to, and even better, I don’t have clients. A lot of people work form home and don’t have a boss, but still don’t work for themselves, because they have clients (Ooooh, I like that. I’m going to use that if I ever write a book ). Clients are very often much worse than having a boss.

Fortunately I’m able to escape both clients and a boss. I work for myself, and myself only.

3. Challenge

I’m a very competitive person by nature, which I think is a good thing. I love the challenge of being an Internet entrepreneur, and the freedom and creativity it carries with it. I’ve worked a number of ‘real’ jobs in the past, none of which ever challenged my abilities or creativity. I’m sure that 95% of people who work traditional jobs feel the same way.

4. Money Potential

And then, of course, there is the income potential. A traditional job will give you the relative security of a fixed amount of income each month, with the possibility of a small wage increase if fortunate enough. But the web can make multi-millionaires overnight.

Gyutae: If you didn’t have an online business, what job or profession do you see yourself having?

Tyler: That’s very hard to say because I can’t picture myself doing anything else anymore. Even before I did this ‘web entrepreneur’ stuff, I worked with the Internet and computers: I had owned a tiny business called Tyler’s Photo Restoration where I restored or colorized old photos with Photoshop, I was the web developer for a real estate company here for a couple years, and before that I worked at an Internet access centre.

So to answer your question, I’d probably still be doing something Internet related, but just working for somebody else. Perhaps working as a web designer, SEO, or something like that.

Gyutae: You’re well known for being very transparent about your websites and your income. How has this influenced the way you do business? For good or for bad?

Tyler: The only way I think this influenced how I conduct my day to day operations is that I am much more cautious and hesitant about sharing information. I’ve had a lot of copycats, people who have ripped off my sites completely, purchasing similar domains, copying my designs, web content, etc.

The best example, though, would be revealing my designer and programming sources. I think that one of the hardest things in this business is to find quality, affordable, and reliable designers and programmers. I used to reveal who I used, which was a very bad decision.

For example, I used to use vBulletinSkinz.com, but what happened was that so many people flocked to them, and not only did vBulletinSkinz raise their price because of the newfound heavy demand, but I found myself having to wait months because the waiting list was so long. And, of course, several of my competitors used them as well.

As a result, I now keep who I use a secret if I can, unless some sort of deal is made.

Gyutae: Who is your greatest online money making inspiration?

Tyler: A lot of people think I kiss John Chow’s ass, but I don’t care. He deserves the recognition. I saw him build his blog up from when it was fairly new, to what it is today, and he’s now making over $23,000 a month from it.

John is just a very smart guy and understands how to make a buck. He’s not just a successful blogger; he ran, and still runs, TheTechZone.com which is a very successful technology review site, and employs a number of people. And he’s had his hand in countless online projects and endeavors that most JC fans don’t even know about.

And his knowledge with money doesn’t just apply to the Internet; he’s very good with finances, investing, and real estate.

John is now a superstar of blogging, has been on TV several times, on the front cover of major newspapers, and best of all has fun doing it. This is why John is my hero

Gyutae: If you could only own 1 website, which niche would you choose?

Tyler: Hmm… I’d have to say that would depend on a few things such as how big the site was, if I had to build it from the ground up or it was already established, etc. Depending on these factors, I’d probably choose poker.

Poker is just simply one of the highest-paying niches out there, but it’s also one of my hobbies and passions.

Gyutae: Any tips for a young and aspiring Internet entrepreneur just getting started?

Tyler: Ah, the million-dollar question. I’d like to make two suggestions that are a bit offbeat:

1. Limit the amount of reading you do.

Reading blogs and forums is an invaluable tool, and I’m not suggesting not to do this, but I think what happens to a lot of people is that they’ll start reading blogs such as JohnChow.com, Problogger.net, and Shoemoney.com or forums such as DigitalPoint and Sitepoint, and end up simply becoming followers or ever worse, just simple passive readers.

You have to get out there and do your own stuff. Work. Think. Do. Yes, it all sounds very lame like some cheap Tony Robbins inspirational book, but it’s true. Too many people bask in the glory of others and start to live vicariously through them, instead of trying to actually become them.

I actually rarely visit webmaster forums or read web entrepreneur blogs anymore. The exception is JohnChow.com where I usually skim through the posts once every couple days.

So, try to limit the amount of blogs and forums you frequent or bookmark. Of course, you need to subscribe to my RSS and visit TylerCruz.com everyday; that is the exception

2. Don’t be afraid to spend money.

Part of the definition of entrepreneurship, in my opinion, is risk. Do you have to spend money to make money? No, you don’t. But I think it’s a lot faster and easier to do so.

If you’re making $100 a day at you day job, spending $160 for a vBulletin license instead of using the free phpBB board is only two days wage. Getting a beautifully designed skin or website is only a week’s wage. Try to look at things like that, and not “Oh gosh, I can’t risk $700 on this stuff!”.

People waste money on beer runs and Pay-Per-View fights that could potentially be the changing factor in their online business, so don’t be afraid to spend a few bucks online. Just don’t go overboard and take out a second mortgage on your home.

Internet Marketing Blog - Make Money Online Copyright 2009 Winning the Web. All Rights Reserved.



Interview with Tyler Cruz, an Internet Entrepreneur

• Interview with Ms. Danielle, Online Super Woman
• Interview with Prija from Blogging the Movie
• Interview with SEO Aaron Wall’s Wife, Giovanna
• Interview with Gab Goldenberg, 21 Year Old SEO Consultant of SEO ROI
• Interviews with Gyutae Park of Winning the Web